I think it's a mistake to go into "reload" mode

[Southern9er]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

Yes. I want to re-build. I see a 2nd tier roster with a 1st tier head coach who out-played its talent level last year.

If the Niners had a great QB I would be singing a different tune.

In fact I'd not only trade Justin Smith for a 1st rounder I'd trade Sopoaga for the right price.

Then I'd try to sign Mario Williams.

Granted I haven't read the whole thread just the first couple of exchanges, but Sick...this is madness...

2nd tier roster??? By what analysis? By what standard and measurement? Are you doing this in a dead dogma sort of way?

The team that we have which was slowly assembled over the years, some good some bad, is a great team that needs some improving just like any team including GB, NO, and other power houses. The true missing piece was the head coach. And for the guys that you consider second tier could it be that those players are that way because they haven't had good coaching to develop?

This team and each individual will only continue to get better with Harbaugh and Co. He gave them the one thing they needed most CONFIDENCE and a deep understanding that they can win. Lucky? That's a ridiculous argument that could be made about any team that made the playoffs.

Does GB need to rebuild?

[iHATEdodgers]

I think when 49 guys think this is madness and no one thinks it's a good idea except you, er, it's not you it's me baby

Not a single dude has agreed with you as far as I can tell. That is not a good sign that you are on the right track. Unless of course you are delusional. I think you're just fanatical and that's ok. You're also wrong. But that's ok too.

[deep9er]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

DO YOU PEOPLE READ BEFORE YOU HIT REPLY??? I freeking said that was a way to PREDICT possible outcomes not to evaluate them as QBs. Obviously you evaluate more specifically on past performances.

Oh and how the crap is Jamarcus Russell an above average QB???

The point is Alex is an average QB. Kaepernick is an unknown; he's just as likely to out-perform Alex as he is to perform worse than Alex as he is to perform about the same. If the rest of the team were talented enough to have a good chance of winning the SB next year with an average QB you go with the average QB. The Niners are not talented enough to likely win the SB next year, so they should go with the unknown rather than pay 10 million a year for an average QB because when the cheaper guy will probably perform pretty similarly (as would a possibly cheap FA like Chad Henne).

Alex Smith may be 'average' measured across the NFL, but he's 'above average' playing for the 49ers. if he signs for ~$10M, then he's being paid like an 'above average' QB, whats the problem?

you're trying to make it a money issue too, but its paying him what its worth same as any player. Kap is paid $1.6M for a reason.......he ISN'T 'average'.

if we guess wrong with Kap, all that occurred last season will fall apart. losing accelerates the problems, even the smallest ones.

[NinerSickness]

Originally Posted by iHATEdodgers

I think when 49 guys think this is madness and no one thinks it's a good idea except you, er, it's not you it's me baby

Not a single dude has agreed with you as far as I can tell. That is not a good sign that you are on the right track. Unless of course you are delusional. I think you're just fanatical and that's ok. You're also wrong. But that's ok too.

You know what else was a 49 to 1 ratio? People here who, after the Niners beat the Saints, thought the Niners would win the superbowl. I don't know anyone else besides I who said they wouldn't. I didn't want to be right, but I was.

[NinerSickness]

Originally Posted by deep9er

Alex Smith may be 'average' measured across the NFL, but he's 'above average' playing for the 49ers. if he signs for ~$10M, then he's being paid like an 'above average' QB, whats the problem?

The problem is I pretty much know how Alex is going to perform, and it's not going to be good enough to win a SB.

If the Niners take the money Alex was going to make and pump the team up a little bit for Kaep or another QB the Niners acquire by signing a couple WRs or even a pass rusher I think the chances of the Niners winning a SB in the next few years is much better.

[MHSL82]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

You know what else was a 49 to 1 ratio? People here who, after the Niners beat the Saints, thought the Niners would win the superbowl. I don't know anyone else besides I who said they wouldn't. I didn't want to be right, but I was.

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

The problem is I pretty much know how Alex is going to perform, and it's not going to be good enough to win a SB.

If the Niners take the money Alex was going to make and pump the team up a little bit for Kaep or another QB the Niners acquire by signing a couple WRs or even a pass rusher I think the chances of the Niners winning a SB in the next few years is much better.

Big deal, I don't pat people on the back for doubting their team and gloating about it afterwards. Sports suck if it isn't for hope. Ask me whether we would win the Superbowl before the NYG game, I'd say I wouldn't bet on it or against it. Now that isn't because I think we are world beater everywhere but I know how games can go either way. Our roster, besides Williams, was talented enough to win (but not enough to bet on it). Everyone can harp on Smith, but we really were that close. Maybe you don't go rolling the dice again with that, but it was talented enough.

And I don't care how many times you say it, you don't know what we're going to get with Alex, especially when analysts say the quarterback position is most dependent and most important position. We could improve our roster and that'll bring more from Smith (or Kaep).

[Flyingiguana]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

The problem is I pretty much know how Alex is going to perform, and it's not going to be good enough to win a SB.

If the Niners take the money Alex was going to make and pump the team up a little bit for Kaep or another QB the Niners acquire by signing a couple WRs or even a pass rusher I think the chances of the Niners winning a SB in the next few years is much better.

just like everyone bashed me for saying smith was the best free agent option this past offseason?

he might not turn into a pro bowler, but he's still on pace for a rich gannon style career. i would have liked to see some improvement in the 2nd half of the year, but we had so many injuries it's hard to get a good read on smith or even roman for that matter.

[deep9er]

Originally Posted by iHATEdodgers

I think when 49 guys think this is madness and no one thinks it's a good idea except you, er, it's not you it's me baby

Not a single dude has agreed with you as far as I can tell. That is not a good sign that you are on the right track. Unless of course you are delusional. I think you're just fanatical and that's ok. You're also wrong. But that's ok too.

if Alex Smith was inconsistent, we barely got into the play-offs, and we easily lost the wildcard game, i MIGHT'VE agreed with Sick?

however, that was not the case...........this TEAM was consistent enough all season, won enough games to get the #2 seed, and beat a good team in New Orleans.

increasing the offense from "below average" to "average", will make big difference next season. continuity plus a quality WR just might do it?

[iHATEdodgers]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

You know what else was a 49 to 1 ratio? People here who, after the Niners beat the Saints, thought the Niners would win the superbowl. I don't know anyone else besides I who said they wouldn't. I didn't want to be right, but I was.

That is such a horribly pathetic and asinine post. You are delusional. The Niners were one fluke/foolish play from making it to the Super Bowl so your claim to fame is just fucking retarded. And delusional. And I'm sticking with the 48 other posters who also think you are ridiculously off base and absolutely wrong about your maddenesque meanderings.

[iHATEdodgers]

Originally Posted by deep9er

if Alex Smith was inconsistent, we barely got into the play-offs, and we easily lost the wildcard game, i MIGHT'VE agreed with Sick?however, that was not the case...........this TEAM was consistent enough all season, won enough games to get the #2 seed, and beat a good team in New Orleans.

increasing the offense from "below average" to "average", will make big difference next season. continuity plus a quality WR just might do it?

Yeah even if that were the case, you don't trade Justin Smith, you don't put a playoff team in the hands of an untested rookie who isn't even that big of a prospect, you don't let Rogers walk and... you don't do what sickness is talking about. You ADD to the team.

Continuity, an upgraded WR corps, sign our important FAs, another quality interior lineman and draft the best players for this team out there. It's gonna be tough next year against a 1st place schedule I don't want to see CK or Tolzien trying their luck against that.

[Flyingiguana]

rogers, brown and culliver vs the passing offenses we face next year is gonna be tough on our seconday. -rogers, we're gonna need to clone the 95 super bowl winning offense to keep up

[deep9er]

Originally Posted by iHATEdodgers

Yeah even if that were the case, you don't trade Justin Smith, you don't put a playoff team in the hands of an untested rookie who isn't even that big of a prospect, you don't let Rogers walk and... you don't do what sickness is talking about. You ADD to the team.

Continuity, an upgraded WR corps, sign our important FAs, another quality interior lineman and draft the best players for this team out there. It's gonna be tough next year against a 1st place schedule I don't want to see CK or Tolzien trying their luck against that.

not likely but MIGHT have? let me make this clear, i agree with the FAR majority no question. i agreed earlier this team is too good not to "re-load".

but was trying to see Sick's logic, at least give it a thought before the "F-thats". if this team was bad and went 4-12, then what? trading quality players for quality draft picks make sense? not a blanket statement, but depends on the player(s)?

now go into the gray area where we went 7-9 and just missed the play-offs? again, we could still consider trading players who won't see the window?

now what about 9-7, we barely get in the play-offs, and lose decisively? this is likely out of the gray area but barely, so again.......not likely trade but MIGHT'VE?

Justin Smith can't play at this high level forever.

[iHATEdodgers]

Originally Posted by deep9er

not likely but MIGHT have? let me make this clear, i agree with the FAR majority no question. i agreed earlier this team is too good not to "re-load".

but was trying to see Sick's logic, at least give it a thought before the "F-thats". if this team was bad and went 4-12, then what? trading quality players for quality draft picks make sense? not a blanket statement, but depends on the player(s)?

now go into the gray area where we went 7-9 and just missed the play-offs? again, we could still consider trading players who won't see the window?

now what about 9-7, we barely get in the play-offs, and lose decisively? this is likely out of the gray area but barely, so again.......not likely trade but MIGHT'VE?

Justin Smith can't play at this high level forever.

You were clear in your last post but now look, it's been 8 pages of this nonsense so the time for F-thats is here. I agree to some of your what-ifs, but basically if you get a hold of a great player you don't let him go. And in any case there is no what-if - we were 13-3, 1 boneheaded play away from the Super Bowl and so, you DON'T trade away your best players and you don't not resign your best FAs.

[Southern9er]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

The problem is I pretty much know how Alex is going to perform, and it's not going to be good enough to win a SB.

If the Niners take the money Alex was going to make and pump the team up a little bit for Kaep or another QB the Niners acquire by signing a couple WRs or even a pass rusher I think the chances of the Niners winning a SB in the next few years is much better.

No, you don't. That is absolutely ridiculous. Did you "know" that Alex was going to perform like he did this year? That by QB rating he would be top 10? One of, if not the highest TD/INT ratio? That he would lead multiple game winning drives, with a well below average WR group?

Your argument is extremely short sighted in that you are giving NO credence to Smith improving this off season just like he did last off season...during a lockout...with a rookie NFL head coach. Harbaugh has just begun his work with Smith. I think his play next season will increase exponentially because of what he accomplished this year. He has repaired his confidence and his mind after seven extremely unfortunate years.

This is pure impatience...and the part about trading J Smith is just beyond me...you don't give up one of if not the most complete DEs in the game...his fourth quarter is better than any OL's 1st quarter. His late game heroics won two games by my count.

[deep9er]

Originally Posted by iHATEdodgers

You were clear in your last post but now look, it's been 8 pages of this nonsense so the time for F-thats is here. I agree to some of your what-ifs, but basically if you get a hold of a great player you don't let him go. And in any case there is no what-if - we were 13-3, 1 boneheaded play away from the Super Bowl and so, you DON'T trade away your best players and you don't not resign your best FAs.

ahh, thats true too, 8 pages of Sick still trying to defend his premise.....ok.

regarding our FA's, we'll try to sign them alright but this doesn't mean we will. Goldson and Rogers in particular, signed one year deals for a reason.

look at Snyder, is he the starter or will we continue to seek a RG? so from his point of view might as well listen to other offers? i'm sure at this point in his career, he wants to remain a starter.

will Brooks re-sign knowing Aldon will have the benefit of the doubt?

[iHATEdodgers]

Originally Posted by deep9er

ahh, thats true too, 8 pages of Sick still trying to defend his premise.....ok.

regarding our FA's, we'll try to sign them alright but this doesn't mean we will. Goldson and Rogers in particular, signed one year deals for a reason.

look at Snyder, is he the starter or will we continue to seek a RG? so from his point of view might as well listen to other offers? i'm sure at this point in his career, he wants to remain a starter.

will Brooks re-sign knowing Aldon will have the benefit of the doubt?

That's true I have no idea who will get signed but I know that they should sign Rogers, Goldson, Brooks and to a lesser extent Snyder.

Rogers - has said he wants to come back so they should be able to come to an agreement.

Goldson - I dunno depends on a few things. If I was him #1 this team is good, playoff quality, the coaching staff is good. I'd come back based on that, but I have no idea what the Niners will offer him... bottom line if he wants to come back they should bring him back.

Brooks - He plays opposite Aldon so I don't think there's an issue there.

Snyder - Bring him back if you can, but yeah look to upgrade as well. Whether or not he wants to stick around - I mean how much interest will there be in him? Just don't go into next season with Rachal as the starter.

[NinerSickness]

Originally Posted by MHSL82

Big deal, I don't pat people on the back for doubting their team and gloating about it afterwards.

I'm not gloating, I'm showing you that I'm probably one of the most (if not the most) objective 49er fan on this forum. I love to be right about 49ers I think will be great, and I love to be wrong about the ones I think will be bad. I want 'em to win a SB just as much as you do. I just think I'm more realistic about how the Niners can get anough talent to have a good chance of doing so.

Originally Posted by Flyingiguana

just like everyone bashed me for saying smith was the best free agent option this past offseason?.

Who bashed you for that? A lot of people here held that opinion. I did too.
Alex being "on pace" to have a Rich Gannon career isn't really saying a whole lot by the way. That's like saying a rookie QB is great because he had a better rookie year than Peyton Manning. Rich Gannon was one of the best QBs in the NFL for a short stretch.

[NinerSickness]

Originally Posted by iHATEdodgers

That is such a horribly pathetic and asinine post. You are delusional. The Niners were one fluke/foolish play from making it to the Super Bowl so your claim to fame is just fucking retarded. And delusional. And I'm sticking with the 48 other posters who also think you are ridiculously off base and absolutely wrong about your maddenesque meanderings.

You're almost not even worth respinding to at this point, but I'll give you another one:

I was probably the ONLY person who sait it was a good idea to let Franklin walk this offseason and let Soap play NT. People like you, who talk like complete homers, were agast at letting "The Achor" of the defense (and former franchise player) go when he's "one of the best NTs in the NFL." The 95% were wrong about this one too.

[imac_21]

Originally Posted by NinerSickness

I'm not gloating, I'm showing you that I'm probably one of the most (if not the most) objective 49er fan on this forum. I love to be right about 49ers I think will be great, and I love to be wrong about the ones I think will be bad. I want 'em to win a SB just as much as you do. I just think I'm more realistic about how the Niners can get anough talent to have a good chance of doing so.



Who bashed you for that? A lot of people here held that opinion. I did too.
Alex being "on pace" to have a Rich Gannon career isn't really saying a whole lot by the way. That's like saying a rookie QB is great because he had a better rookie year than Peyton Manning. Rich Gannon was one of the best QBs in the NFL for a short stretch.

I'm curious, who said the Niners WOULD win the Super Bowl after they beat New Orleans? I remember people saying they COULD, but to say they WOULD is pushing it.

Of course, you claim to have said the WOULDN'T , which implies that you gave the Niners no chance at winning the Super Bowl.

[NinerSickness]

I don't really want to go back through the forum the entire season, but I've been consistent saying the Niners didn't have enough talent to have a REALISTIC chance of winning a SB, and they didn't. That was a very unpopular opinion. And talent means all 53 players, so depth comes into play.

And the Niners got a lot more good luck this season than bad luck (like having the tie breaker to have home field advantage against the Saints & not having a lot of injuries).

The posts about Franklin from the Disney forum are gone, so you'll just have to take my word for it